#tikiwiki 2008-09-29,Mon

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Who	What	When
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PS\|bot	SVN: Commit by sewilco :: r 14897 /branches/2.0/ (3 files in 2 dirs): [NEW] Add galleryId to show_image.php to show one image from a gallery.	[18:08]
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PS\|bot	SVN: Commit by lphuberdeau :: r 14898 /trunk/tiki-wikiplugin_edit.php: [ENH] Support for all plugin syntaxes in plugin editor	[19:02]
sylvieg	(01:55:41 PM) marclaporte: philippeback: : what is your Sourceforge username?	[19:10]
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SEWilco2	Odd. I activated htaccess and the Admin icons changed back to the little old icons. Oh, well, time to update that site to trunk anyway.	[19:35]
PS\|bot	SVN: Commit by lphuberdeau :: r 14899 /trunk/lib/wiki-plugins/wikiplugin_cookie.php: [FIX] Bad extract in cookie plugin (thx pkdille)	[19:43]
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philippeback	my sourceforge id: philippeback very easy :-)	[19:55]
macjaeger	how inventiv :-)	[19:57]
sylvieg	ok philippeback added - I have no time to handle the ceremony now. Somebody want to do it ... otherwise it is : do you haev read the 3 rules and agree with them?	[19:58]
SEWilco2	http://dev.tikiwiki.org/tiki-index.php?page=3Rules	[19:59]
philippeback	yes I did macjaeger: indeed :-) no issue sylvieg, just want to have my toolset ready and the trunk checkout here. will take a while to do I guess...	[20:00]
SEWilco2	Also see: http://dev.tikiwiki.org/tiki-index.php?page=How+to+get+commit+access	[20:02]
philippeback	done RTFM done :-)	[20:02]
sylvieg	thx SEWilco2	[20:02]
SEWilco2	Well, that's the first 2 parts of the ceremony. Anyone remember the third part?	[20:02]
sylvieg	have a beer...	[20:03]
macjaeger	is that when he invites you for a drink?	[20:03]
lphuberdeau_	philippeback: you really read doc.tw.o and tiki for smarties entirely&	[20:03]
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lphuberdeau_	?	[20:03]
SEWilco2	SEWilco2 is fresh out of rum... starts boiling down Coke to get enough sugar.	[20:03]
macjaeger	:-)	[20:04]
SEWilco2	Shall we consider philippeback ceremonied, then?	[20:04]
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SEWilco2	SEWilco2 recently went through the ceremony but the alcohol apparently erased part of the memory.	[20:05]
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macjaeger	maybe it's only sunken deep into the liquid... plunge into the bottle, see if you can find it at the bottom! <-- doesn't drink alcohol at all, only makes me tired	[20:06]
SEWilco2	I reckon you're in, then. Welcome. Submit if you've got one, else wait until after the hangover before coding more. SEWilco2 drinks more in IRC than IRL. Makes do with only the canned part of rum & Coke.	[20:07]
snarlydwarf	http://travel.webshots.com/photo/1399282039064817046nncasl?vhost=travel ... a picture of rum and coke in a can. tho some annoying ad crap before it.	[20:18]
macjaeger	i like the can would make a nice addition to my fathers "canned art" collection	[20:19]
snarlydwarf	just have to keep SEWilco2 from drinkning the contents	[20:20]
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macjaeger	nay, we'd make a good team him drinking, me collecting the can :-)	[20:20]
SEWilco2	... or setting fire to them. Need relevant illumination during the Ceremony.	[20:21]
macjaeger	oh yeah, i guess rum&coke might add up for a nice molotov surrogat?	[20:21]
SEWilco2	SEWilco2 supports talking like drinking like a pirate. Arr.	[20:22]
macjaeger	sorry, but you know that jack sparrow's already casted to mr. depp again? too late to apply for that job	[20:22]
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philippeback	for full disclosure: belgium here :-D Who's speaking about a beer ? lphuberdeau, not sure if I read it all but definitely walked around for a (very) significant while. Same with the source code. I am using tiki as our groupware at metachannel SA, a startup where I am the CTO. We do pocasting solutions and tiki has been selected as my technical base of choice for developing stuff.	[20:58]
lphuberdeau_	nice how long have you been using it for?	[21:02]
philippeback	A year or so I guess. All meeting minutes, files, mp3s and documents are in. Also, we do use the blogs, the file galleries, image galleries, categories since we do use it for speccing systems for which the dev is outsourced.	[21:02]
lphuberdeau_	hmmm.... seems like you waited somewhere between 11 and 12 months too long before asking for commit access	[21:03]
philippeback	Also used modules to integrate flex apps we do and silverlight RIAs categories is really the feature that brought me to tiki w/ security permissions otherwise, we do use vtiger as CRM and I saw that there was a mod for integrating it into Tiki (not yet had time to look at it). On the CMS front, I have to continue filling in some content on the PromoSquad page on dev.tw.o (the What is a CMS). I do have about 50 pages more in word to type in.	[21:03]
lphuberdeau_	permission system both attracts and scare away people... quite fun	[21:05]
philippeback	Permission is a key selling point for Tiki IMHO without that, you only have groups and it sucks hierarchy + object perms ===> cool	[21:06]
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philippeback	and needed for giving limited access to partners without having to structure the pages all the time. In fact, I used to be a Java guy but PHP is now my choice for the web. Best thing is to use Quercus on something like Resin. PHP on JEE. That's very nice. Is tiki running fine on Quercus ?	[21:06]
lphuberdeau_	what we really need is a comprehensive UI for permissions... unless you really know what you are doing, it's really complicated to understand what's going on	[21:08]
philippeback	Bah, once you get used to it, that's okay. There is intrinsic complexity in the model. Power will not come free.	[21:08]
lphuberdeau_	never heard of Quercus	[21:09]
philippeback	Quercus is a free .war that allows you to run PHP code on a java platform (caucho.com)/ so, we can thing of scaling out a PHP app easily. Coupled with something like Terracotta, you can get a massively scalable application.	[21:09]
lphuberdeau_	there was some project by IBM to run PHP on the Java stack, replacing the Zend Engine basically... but it was pretty much destroyed by the core PHP devs asking about licencing issues... was one funny moment	[21:10]
philippeback	Quercus is alive and kicking. And Open Source. http://quercus.caucho.com/ Quercus implements PHP 5 and a growing list of PHP extensions including APC, iconv, GD, gettext, JSON, MySQL, Oracle, PDF, and Postgres. Many popular PHP application will run as well as, if not better, than the standard PHP interpreter straight out of the box. The growing list of PHP software certified running on Quercus includes DokuWiki, Drupal, Gallery2, Joomla, Mambo, Mantis, MediaWiki, Phorum, phpBB, phpMyAdmin, PHP-Nuke, Wor So, Tiki not yet in the list !!!!	[21:10]
lphuberdeau_	you would need to try it	[21:12]
philippeback	I will have to.	[21:12]
lphuberdeau_	except the fact that you can write extensions in Java, it seems to do the same thing as Zend Platform... which is really a packaging of tools	[21:13]
philippeback	Well, here you put the war in your servlet engine and just configure the mapping for .php extension and bingo, just as PHP	[21:13]
lphuberdeau_	apc+memcached and you get similar results app still needs to take advantage of it	[21:13]
philippeback	well, yes. But: no filter features as in JEE or no jndi naming for the dbs no background taks memcached is cool indeed.	[21:14]
lphuberdeau_	I'm not really a java guy... kind of have other tricks to do all that	[21:15]
philippeback	if you have terracotta running on the JVMs, it makes a huge heap of lots of Gigs or RAM and everyhting shall run as a single box (mostly) Well, with memcached it is fine.	[21:15]
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philippeback	But my point is that we do ads delivery. I kind of integrated podcast tagging and search with file galleries and categories along with the ads server (openx) so this means a lot of invocations. Tiki shall be put the test there :-) Are you from France ?	[21:16]
lphuberdeau_	Montreal	[21:17]
nalioth	so what can you do with a tikiwiki?	[21:20]
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philippeback	so, back to my Tiki-Fuing session :-)	[21:20]
Caarrie	what cant you do with a tikiwiki?	[21:20]
philippeback	Practice makes perfect :)	[21:20]
macjaeger	tikiwiki won't make coffee for me	[21:20]
nalioth	i just installed one and have no clue what to do with it	[21:20]
Caarrie	hehe why did you install it?	[21:20]
nalioth	your website says blog/forum/etc/etc	[21:21]
lphuberdeau_	macjaeger, I've seen someone do coffee from PHP, so if that's all your missing... I can make a call	[21:21]
Caarrie	hehe nalioth: http://twbasics.keycontent.org/ might help you some	[21:21]
lphuberdeau_	nalioth, tikiwiki has many features... depending on how you combine and configure them, it can do almost anything	[21:23]
nalioth	lphuberdeau_: mmkay	[21:23]
lphuberdeau_	what do you really want to do?	[21:24]
Caarrie	as i said [Mon 5:21:53 pm] <Caarrie> what cant you do with a tikiwiki? ;)	[21:24]
philippeback	coffee included, just write a mod	[21:24]
Caarrie	hehe	[21:24]
nalioth	so who wrote the 'for smarties' guide?	[21:24]
lphuberdeau_	ricks99	[21:24]
macjaeger	well, i guess i miss that ip-enabled coffeemachine	[21:24]
lphuberdeau_	(well, most of it I guess)	[21:25]
Caarrie	Caarrie laughs	[21:25]
philippeback	{drink(type=>coffee,sugar=>y,espresso=>n)/}	[21:25]
Caarrie	no sugar and iced please	[21:25]
macjaeger	make tht DRINK	[21:25]
nalioth	nalioth grumbles cuz it was full of Windows pictures	[21:25]
macjaeger	to stay conform what's wrong with windows pictures, nalioth?	[21:25]
lphuberdeau_	macjaeger: no, it implied inwiring the controls and plugging them on a microconroller, and plugging it via a serial port... from there, PHP could read/write it like a file	[21:26]
philippeback	{DRINK(type=>coffee,sugar=>n,espresso=>n,iced=>y)/}	[21:26]
Caarrie	;)	[21:26]
macjaeger	hmm... sounds promising	[21:26]
nalioth	macjaeger: i'm not using Windows	[21:26]
macjaeger	so?	[21:26]
lphuberdeau_	actually, from 3.0... {drink type=cofee sugar=y espresso=n}	[21:26]
philippeback	drinkcontroller.dll	[21:27]
Caarrie	not a dll :(	[21:27]
philippeback	ok drinkcontroller.so	[21:27]
Caarrie	better	[21:27]
philippeback	*nix forever :-)	[21:27]
nalioth	i will give teh 'for smartied' guide a glance	[21:27]
Caarrie	kubuntu/leopard ;)	[21:27]
macjaeger	give it more than a glance, it's really a good starting point	[21:28]
philippeback	I have to admit that my dev is done on Win. Used Ubuntu on a box for 3 months straight (only that, nothing else) in an enterprise environment. A nightmare !	[21:28]
macjaeger	even if the window frames are not what you're used to, the contents are the same on whatever system you're using	[21:28]
Caarrie	now try doing vb.net on linux :P	[21:28]
philippeback	Back to windows now for the laptops (with a VM running Ubuntu) and my servers running Debian Linux mono is quite ok. Dunno if vb.net exists;	[21:28]
Caarrie	the forms dont work	[21:29]
philippeback	We do Flex and Silverlight. Silverlight much easier to work with.	[21:30]
lphuberdeau_	philippeback, I've worked at a place where everyone worked from linux machines... over a hundred seats... was marvelous ;)	[21:30]
philippeback	Anyway, I do PHP, Java, Tcl/Tk and Flex. Silverlight work is outsourced in china.	[21:30]
macjaeger	i'm doomed to stay with windows as long as my employers like it better... and as that's a government there won't be any changes soon	[21:30]
Caarrie	Caarrie hands her eggdrop bot to philippeback to debug :P	[21:30]
philippeback	Well, WiFi sucked with some Cisco thingies using specific crypto eggdrop: cool !	[21:31]
Caarrie	i got 2 ;) Caarrie points to PS\|bot	[21:31]
philippeback	printers did not print properly (pics shifted by a few pixels) USB sticks just got scrambled by Linux OpenOffice saving in MS Office format : issues with drawings (not good when presenting) and : battery on linux: 1h30. On Windows with all proper drivers: 3h	[21:31]
Caarrie	i dont go on battery much, unless i am on my macbook ;)	[21:32]
philippeback	also, hibernate on laptop and linux: cross your fingers and expect to restart 2 times out of 3.	[21:33]
Caarrie	i dont shut down unless i _have_ to :P	[21:33]
philippeback	So, linux: ok for a dev box on a desktop.	[21:33]
macjaeger	linux for laptops is tricky	[21:33]
philippeback	I do move around all day long when I am making money for funding the startup.	[21:33]
macjaeger	at least	[21:33]
philippeback	well, 3 months of suffering I tell you.	[21:34]
Caarrie	Caarrie has a laptop running linux ;)	[21:34]
philippeback	I tried to do everything with it. I mean everything. apt-get was my best friend.	[21:34]
macjaeger	really depends on manufacturer	[21:34]
SEWilco2	info.tw.o has "DEVELOP TIKI" on a separate line instead of next to the other menu items.	[21:34]
philippeback	Dell Latitude D430, small 12" laptop	[21:34]
macjaeger	some build fine portables from selected, well known components	[21:35]
philippeback	Also, things like dia were not working when moving the file from linux to win.	[21:35]
macjaeger	others build as cheap as possible, using whatever chips they can get	[21:35]
philippeback	all skewed	[21:35]
Caarrie	i have a dell xps m1710 atm ;) :P	[21:36]
philippeback	yeah, but linux is great for some use cases xps cool here: Dell D430, Asus W1N, Asus A7V, Acer 5670 WLi	[21:36]
SEWilco2	SEWilco2 wishes he owned an ATM.	[21:36]
macjaeger	macjaeger wishes he owned that ip-enabled coffeemaker right now sigh will have to go upstairs, do it manually again.	[21:37]
Caarrie	hehe	[21:37]
philippeback	guarana seeds box near me :-)	[21:38]
SEWilco2	SEWilco2 prepares an espresso double latte with sprinkles for macjaeger. Pick it up at the MIT IP-enabled coffeemaker.	[21:38]
philippeback	back to tiki: what I do love is that it brings back the fun of coding :-)	[21:39]
SEWilco2	SEWilco2 could use with somewhat less fun on some days. :-)	[21:39]
philippeback	what I hate is that the CSS has to be tweaked like hell to get decent boxes.	[21:39]
SEWilco2	You volunteering to code a CSS box editor?	[21:40]
Caarrie	philippeback: the css is being worked on lately	[21:40]
philippeback	I've done a new box with an additional class instead of the cbox thing by default. So: cbox, myboxtype1, mybxtype2 so colors can be changed, styles too bg=> is too limited looks like this: {T***BOX(title=>more about Services, bg=>#EFF0F0,topclass=tbox,float=>y)} so, colored boxes and with the proper size all around. why is float=>n the default BTW ? drove me nuts with css positioning Firebug good enough for me as CSS box editor as is WebDev toolbar CSS Edit :-)	[21:40]
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crybaby	hello i am ready to shhot myself because tiki makes everything more difficult than it should nand my host provider is horrible! i need help please anyone	[22:44]
lphuberdeau_	slow down	[22:44]
crybaby	i need the latest tiki but wait what one is that	[22:44]
lphuberdeau_	2.1	[22:44]
crybaby	they cant have just one link ok i go to 2.1 and there are several files which one	[22:44]
lphuberdeau_	3 are the same, just different compression the last one is an incremental update if you are using 2.0	[22:45]
crybaby	NO I AM STARTING FROM SCRATCH can you link me to the one link that i need to download the latest tiki to base my website around	[22:46]
lphuberdeau_	no need to scream, just use one of the 3 first files then	[22:46]
crybaby	which one	[22:46]
Caarrie	any of them they are the same	[22:46]
lphuberdeau_	they contain the same code	[22:47]
crybaby	are they all identical than why do they have 3?	[22:47]
Caarrie	[Mon 6:46:47 pm] <lphuberdeau_> 3 are the same, just different compression	[22:47]
crybaby	oh i see there tiki goes making things easy	[22:47]
lphuberdeau_	windows people like zip, but the compression is terrible	[22:47]
crybaby	ok gereat i have all 3 downloaded	[22:47]
Caarrie	tikiwiki is not _easy_ it takes time to use and learn to use no you dont need all 3	[22:47]
crybaby	i know that now thank you	[22:47]
Caarrie	he said that already to you	[22:48]
crybaby	so i am trying to FTP over to my host	[22:48]
lphuberdeau_	hum... please calm down... no need to be rude, we're really trying to help	[22:48]
crybaby	i know i am not trying to be i have been up for practically 4 days straight jsut to be able to edit my site mocha host =[	[22:48]
Caarrie	crybaby: try reading http://twbasics.keycontent.org/tiki-index.php?page=Manual%20Installation&structure=TikiWiki%20for%20Smarties	[22:49]
lphuberdeau_	get some sleep, it will help	[22:49]
crybaby	cant i use a tiki interface on this site to transfer files? ok thanks caaaarie	[22:49]
Caarrie	what tiki interface?	[22:50]
crybaby	i see the dude on all the tutorials use them	[22:50]
Caarrie	what tutorials?	[22:51]
crybaby	so are you saying i am done once i download all the tiki files on my server i have been watching tutorials on tiki for two days hang on i am having a lot of pc problems now i will be back and thanks =]	[22:51]
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Caarrie	ok what was that about :P	[22:54]
lphuberdeau_	something to forget	[22:54]
Caarrie	that sounds like a good idea	[22:54]
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PS\|bot	SVN: Commit by matwho :: r 14900 /trunk/ (6 files in 6 dirs): [MOD] and [FIX] Added some new permissions for webmail to control who can use ond/or create mail accounts. Fixed lost of other errors in webmail. Improved error reports when connecting to POP server.	[23:29]
MatWho	lost = lots good night all!	[23:30]
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