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kstingel: .. if it was, I would add it to my dev box and test :)
gour: <u>kstingel</u>: what? fossil?
kstingel: I canj't recall exactly which software it was ... you mentioned it a few days back, as a possible solution for something ...
<br> I went looking for an Ubuntu installer, and there wasn't one available ... and I'm not familiar enuf with Ubuntu to build my own
gour: <u>kstingel</u>: dvcs, instead of svn or something else?
kstingel: it was a svn replacement, so it may have been DVCS
gour: <u>kstingel</u>: see http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=fossil&searchon=names&suite=quantal&section=all
<br> it's packaged even for windows ;)
<br> ask changi...he used on ubuntu to do svn --> git --> fossil test the other day
<br> *used it
<br> moreover, it's avaialble for debian, which means that it follows for ubuntu as well :-)
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kstingel: <u>gour</u>: that's weird ... it shows up for quantal ... but it wasn't there in precise ... I guess they haven't backported to the LTS version
<br> will add it to box once current activities complete
gour: <u>kstingel</u>: that would be strange...ubuntu is, along with debian, fedora...definitely on the top of linux-supported distros
<br> <u>kstingel</u>: http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?suite=precise&searchon=names&keywords=fossil
<br> it was available even in lucid - http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?suite=lucid&searchon=names&keywords=fossil
kstingel: I couldn't find it .... but then again, Precise commited suicide shortly after that
<br> ... everything crashed
gour: <u>kstingel</u>: but be careful..after trying fossil, you svn taste might become a bit bitter ;)
<br> *your
kstingel: I'm not really that attached to SVN now :)
gour: that's good...fossil is really simple & powerful
<br> http://fossil-scm.org/index.html/doc/trunk/www/quickstart.wiki
<br> my hosting support stuff is patching tiki instead of fixing nginx :-(
luciash: aye :(
gour: that's called 'fixing' :-/
<br> here is the patch:
<br> + header('Location: http://atmarama.sites.djangohosting.ch/tiki-index.php');
<br> - header('Location: '.$base_url.$prefs['tikiIndex']);
<br> just asked them what's wrong with redirection in tiki?
luciash: omg
gour: of course, it does not fix anything...it fails with login/logout...
<br> it seems i'm heading towards my own (cheap) VPS...but i'm reluctant to manage whole server, especially mail
luciash: my hoster provides VPS with CentOS + ISPConfig preinstalled which makes the server management a bit "easier"
gour: yeah, i've found one offering with ISPConfig for 50€ add-on, but i'd like to experiment for a month 1st :-)
<br> do you recommend openvz or kvm/xen?
luciash: no idea what is the diff btwn them
gour: kvm/xen are more isolated, openvz is usually cheaper
luciash: i think this one is kvm/xen type
<br> 50 EUR add on seems not too cheap
gour: right
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refizul: <u>gour</u>: if you need only a few services (mail, web), OpenVZ is ok
gour: some offerings also give (for free) http://www.zpanelcp.com/page/features
<br> <u>refizul</u>: i did admin mail with qmal...long ago, but never touched postfix
refizul: <u>gour</u>: if you need a complete virtual machine for whatsoever: KVM
gour: <u>refizul</u>: no, just to host few (tiki) sites along with mail
refizul: Xen is a bit special, but more like KVM than OpenVZ
gour: and would put debian on VPS, as on my localhost
refizul: <u>gour</u>: I had an exim3 and now postfix is really much easier
gour: <u>refizul</u>: is 1G ok for several tiki sites?
refizul: RAM?
gour: yes
refizul: OMG - what kind of zoo do you have?
gour: ?
refizul: 10, 20, 30 sites?
<br> 1G is a lot
luciash: <u>gour</u>: i would rather go with 2G minimum when combined with other services
gour: don't forget, i was evaluating typo3 before coming to tiki :-D
<br> <u>luciash</u>: heh, depends on the budget
luciash: but u can have 30 GB HDD, 1 GB RAM, 1 proc for 10 EUR monthly here
gour: well, mysql+postfix+dovecot+web...that's all
<br> <u>luciash</u>: i've found similar offering for 7€
<br> lowendbox site
<br> atm i pay 8.64/month for 10GB disk space and can use 500MB of RAM, 50 processes and 10 local ports...but so many problems
<br> however, no headache to manage the server...just my own stuff, email adresses + web sites
refizul: that's not good
<br> 50 processes - never seen that before
luciash: here is no limit
<br> excet the disk space and RAM/CPU
gour: time is limit :-)
refizul: what is a local port?
luciash: *except
refizul: is this shared IP?
gour: port over >1000 which i can use for eg. my own webserver, php-fpm etc. whic hare served ny reverse-proxy at the front-end
<br> yes, shared IP...dedicated IP costs extra
refizul: <u>gour</u>: this is a PITA solution
gour: heh
<br> it's semi-shared, like webfaction
refizul: how much traffic do you have?
gour: ssh access and i can build my own stuff
luciash: <u>gour</u>: close to your setup 15 GB HDD, 512 MB RAM, 1 proc. is here for 4.5 EUR
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luciash: dedicated IP
gour: <u>refizul</u>: never had issue with the traffic...not sure...let me check
refizul: order of magnitude 1G/month, 10G/m or 100G/m?
gour: no info for the bandwidth
<br> so, you're managing your own VPS, guys?
<br> the sites are anyway, atm, low-traffic, so no problem with that
luciash: yup
gour: i just wonder how much work it involves...i already manage my debian box, but it's not server exposed to to the wild world
refizul: server is less work than desktop
gour: which os you use?
refizul: but mistakes are more dangerous :-)
gour: what about DNS? is it usually managed by hosting provider?
refizul: yes
luciash: it is ok, lamp + ufw does the job - bigger problem is to manage mail server for me ;)
refizul: usually you'll get two DNS servers from the provider
luciash: yep
gour: yeah, mail= spam + viruses
refizul: but you can replace them with any DNS you like
gour: i never did DNS admin work except entering my dns entries :-)
refizul: spam and viruses are enduser problems *eg*
luciash: ubuntu and centos here so far... used to be gentoo but that is long time ago
gour: you don't filter mail, spf etc.?
luciash: thunderbird does the job ;)
-: gour uses claws
refizul: <u>gour</u>: filtering has got legal issues
gour: <u>refizul</u>: for my own stuff?
refizul: eh - ok, this is something different
gour: :-)
refizul: I run mailservers for other people
gour: i'm not into reseller business
<br> is qmail still alive?
refizul: I hope not
luciash: lol
gour: it was better than sendmail in its era
<br> at least config-wise
refizul: ehm - everything was better than sendmail
luciash: gtg, bbl guys
refizul: there should be a statistic about sendmail usage and admin suicide
<br> gn8 luciash
gour: bye luciash
refizul: low level mail system would be: Debian, postfix + dovecot + postgrey
<br> optional AV scanner
gour: i used to run dovecot on my localhost when using getmail to fetch/sort/filter mail for Gnus...but then decided to return back to claws
refizul: dovecot / claws? dovecot is POP3/IMAP Server, claws a mailclient, isn't it?
<br> do you mean icedove?
gour: no, dovecot...claws was accessing mail served by dovecot in maildir format and was fed by getmail
<br> i was no so trusty about my provider and wanted to keep mail on my own machine (imap server)
refizul: ah - ok
gour: i'm going to sleep as well...it's way too late, but such a day today :-(
<br> 'night
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<br> polom
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refizul: hello Bsfez1
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himanshu__: plz help me to make profile page in tiki and work as Now all new employees, when they sign in first time, they need to fill out necessary info, like picture, About Me section etc etc. and if anything is blank after first login, they need to get automatic reminders until they fix it.
gour: morning
<br> do you agree that having canonical url for web site does matter for SEO?
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arildb: I made some fixes in trunk, which makes the backlinks work properly fro wiki pages in html syntax. This also includes making them work with SEFURL. An important fix for WYSIWYG users. However, I have done minimal testing with wiki syntax installations. This should be done before a backport.
<br> Has anybody checked backlinks the last days?
<br> <u>Note</u>: to rebuild the backlinks set, disable+save+enable+save, in the admin | wiki panel.
-: ricks99 will be glad to see the wysiwyg wiki-link backlink fixed
arildb: For existing wysiwyg installations the rebuild procedure must be done to see existing backling
ricks99: <u>arildb</u>: there's also an issue in tiki9 with wysiwyg when creating a wiki link while adding a different text label (the text label is dropped). have you seen that/fixed that in trunk?
arildb: <u>ricks99</u>: I don't know this problem
ricks99: k. i haven't tested/confirmed in trunk yet
-: ricks99 still knee-deep in tiki9
Tiki-KGB: tikiwiki 03arildb r44203 10branches/10.x/lib/init/initlib.php
<br> tikiwiki [bp/r44202][FIX] missing $_SERVER['REQUEST_URI'] on IIS 6
<br> tikiwiki 03arildb r44204 10branches/9.x/lib/init/initlib.php
<br> tikiwiki [bp/r44202][FIX] missing $_SERVER['REQUEST_URI'] on IIS 6
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<br> polom polom
arildb: hi jonnyb
jonnyb: hi arildb
ricks99: hi jonnyb
jonnyb: hi ricks99 and all
arildb: <u>jonnyb</u>: I made some comments about the backlink fixes for html syntax pages above. I am not sure if you can see it, but it's about backporting of this and testing on installations with wiki syntax
jonnyb: <u>arildb</u>: checking...
<br> i saw the commits but haven't done anything on trunk for a while
<br> i'd say let's back port it after 10.0 release and then testing will happen
<br> we have enough blockers for now :)
arildb: <u>jonnyb</u>: sounds ok
<br> <u>jonnyb</u>: any release date set for 10.0 yet?
jonnyb: a while ago, so as soon as possible i guess
Tiki-KGB: tikiwiki 03jonnybradley r44205 10branches/10.x/lib/smarty_tiki/ 10block.wikiplugin.php 10function.rss.php
<br> tikiwiki [FIX] parser: Reset parserlib options after using context_format (also remove unused globals & include)
<br> tikiwiki Should fix pages such as tiki.org/Stats (where rss and wikiplugin smarty in modules included in a page via a plugin broke almost all other plugins following it) Thanks marclaporte
<br> tikiwiki 03jonnybradley r44206 10branches/10.x/lib/parser/parserlib.php
<br> tikiwiki [FIX] parser: Saving options before plugin execution is required after all as some (trackerlist for instance) resets them and so were breaking in wysiwyg edit - r41705 repair continues... (thanks Geoff)
<br> tikiwiki 03ohertel r44207 10branches/10.x/installer/installlib.php
<br> tikiwiki [fix] avoid error message when table check fails
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kstingel1: polom
<br> is currently hopping between (Windon't and Ubuntu) machines, so pls excuse delays in replys :)
gour: <u>kstingel1</u>: don't hop, but just jump (to ubuntu) ;)
kstingel1: using Windon't as lookup/reference screen whilst adding toys to toybox :) ... Windon't is wired, so lookups are faster
<br> am currently decorating Dev space so it optimises my workflow for Tiki :)
gour: i'd like to start moving my site(s) to tiki...small WP blog produces clean sefurls, but considering i'd use non-apache server, i wonder whether i should be patient and first (try to) write set of rewrite rules for the specific server (converting from apache's htaccess) and then write 301 redirects to migrate from old urls to the new ones or just write 301 redirects, go online and then work on general
<br> rewrite rules for non-apache server?
jonnyb: <u>gour</u>: which rule/s in particular are a problem for non-apache?
gour: <u>jonnyb</u>: no idea...i'm not at all familiar with htaccess, but the point is that all of them has to be written...i'll go htaccess --> nginx --> hiawatha/cherokee using online converters
jonnyb: and what happens?
gour: haven't started yet...just considering proper strategy...however, considering i like what i see in hiawatha, i've to do it ;)
<br> <u>jonnyb</u>: now i see you name in _htaccess ;)
<br> *your
jonnyb: looks like http://www.anilcetin.com/convert-apache-htaccess-to-nginx/ doesn't work properly for us - most things get rewritten to / :(
gour: <u>jonnyb</u>: "#Redirect bogus directories" section is commented. is should stay so?
<br> <u>jonnyb</u>: i find the output of http://winginx.com/htaccess more pleasing
jonnyb: yes, that bogus thing is weird - just a suggestion for how to customise for a specific server issue i tihnk
gour: ok
jonnyb: yes, http://winginx.com/htaccess looks much better and seems to produce proper rules - might even work ;)
Tiki-KGB: tikiwiki 03jyhem r44208 10trunk/templates/tiki-admin_forums.tpl
<br> tikiwiki [FIX] Prevent browser autocompletion so sensitive info is not stored by mistake
<br> tikiwiki 03jyhem r44209 10branches/9.x/templates/tiki-admin_forums.tpl
<br> tikiwiki [FIX][bp/44208] Prevent browser autocompletion so sensitive info is not stored by mistake
jonnyb: <u>gour</u>: as LP said on the list we should really rethink how we handle this - should be derived from the database tiki_sefurl_regex_out table imho
gour: glad to hear it ;)
Jyhem_laptop: and it should be a bijection. Meaning a non-ambiguous conversion from urls to sefurls *and back* !
<br> Right now, if I call a wiki page calendar1, I'm stuck
<br> The sefurl should be something like: page_calendar1
Tiki-KGB: tikiwiki 03jyhem r44210 10branches/10.x/templates/tiki-admin_forums.tpl
<br> tikiwiki [FIX][bp/44208] Prevent browser autocompletion so sensitive info is not stored by mistake
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luciash: polom
gour: <u>jonnyb</u>: having more support for non-apache would be great
jonnyb: moloq luciash
<br> <u>gour</u>: +1
Tiki-KGB: tikiwiki 03jonnybradley r44211 10branches/10.x/lib/categories/categlib.php
<br> tikiwiki [FIX] multilingual: Only do getTranslations on supported types - was breaking blogs when using category_i18n_sync (thanks fabricius, found it at last! :)
jonnyb: but also having "nice" sefurls (like example.com/calendar/42/month/12 for instance)
luciash: <u>jonnyb</u>: that is not that "nice" example ;)
gour: <u>luciash</u>: bolow! is it ok?
luciash: <u>gour</u>: awesome :)
gour: :-)
jonnyb: <u>luciash</u>: what would you perfer?
<br> would be nice to be able to edit them inside tiki so everyone can be different
luciash: nicer would be example.com/calendar/jonny-stuff/month/december
<br> :)
Jyhem_laptop: but then when Jonny renames his calendar, all urls are changed :-(
luciash: that is what 301 redirects are for
<br> ideally that should be handled by tiki to auto-redirect after renaming
<br> with wiki pages too
marclaporte: I like how our blog and article SEFurls are
luciash: could sneak in numer 42 there, ok ;)
<br> *number
<br> calendar/42-jonny-stuff, ok ? ;)
<br> i like it too, but it is not ideal yet for i18n blog/article titles
<br> they should convert to ascii somehow but they delete non-ascii chars instead which looks kinda ugly then
marclaporte: <link rel="canonical" href="http://nextinfo.tiki.org/article192-Tiki-Passes-1-Million-Downloads" />
luciash: would need convert patterns for each language i guess
<br> like "ěščřžýáíé..." => "escrzyaie...";
gour: <u>marclaporte</u>: what do you think about suggestion to change the above url to http://nextinfo.tiki.org/a192-Tiki-Passes-1-Million-Downloads and similarly ../blogxyz/ to ../bxyz ?
luciash: article is better for SEO than "a" imho
gour: good point
luciash: or maybe irrelevant nowadays ? dunno, hmm
<br> blog or article - who cares ? :) the topic / title is most important
<br> some say shorter urls are better for seo too
marclaporte: <u>gour</u>: I think we should start by agreeing on the objectives / concerns
<br> 1- server support
<br> 2- readability
gour: <u>luciash</u>: well, atm i'm accustomed to just http://nextinfo.tiki.org/Tiki-Passes-1-Million-Downloads without those article/blog prefixes and since i've (want) to move my sites to tiki, wonder what kind of 301 redirects to create?
marclaporte: 3- for canonicals to work
kstingel1: <u>marclaporte</u>: 25- API Documentation
marclaporte: 4- Make sure it's possible to rename a blog title / article title, forum thread, etc.
gour: 1) i'll (try to) add for some non-apache
<br> not sure about 2), for 3) i do non-www to www 301
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gour: 4) is future, i want to migrate to tiki first ;)
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marclaporte: 5- Be able to deal with a URL being chopped off accidentally (in an email message line breakage) or intentionally to shorten URL
gour: i should also creat that wiki page concerning url-rewriting bug
-: gour notices that ink connected to 'e' key is getting low :-)
marclaporte: 5- http://dev.tiki.org/blog3-In-the-trenches and http://dev.tiki.org/blogpost22-The-module-ificaton-of-Tiki-themes-easy-module-export-via-profiles-in-Tiki-9-1 are good because http://dev.tiki.org/blogpost22-blabla is still good and search engines can update their index tahnks to <link rel="canonical" href="http://dev.tiki.org/blogpost22-The-module-ificaton-of-Tiki-themes-easy-module-export-via-profiles-in-Tiki-9-1" />
gour: <u>marclaporte</u>: i believe tiki devs are recognizing there are more servers than apache/iis
Tiki-KGB: tikiwiki 03jonnybradley r44212 10branches/10.x/lib/smarty_tiki/block.tabset.php
<br> tikiwiki [FIX] tabs: Fix "no tabs" mode on editpage (thanks luciash)
gour: <u>marclaporte</u>: i'm not so familiar with canonical tag, but wonder how is support for it in general?
<br> so, you recommend me to me leave blog/article prefixes in the URL as they are now by default?
<br> iow, no harm by them?
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luciash: <u>jonnyb</u>: thank you!
jonnyb: np, luciash - has probably been broken for a while, no?
luciash: yeah, long time
<br> but i noticed just recently
marclaporte: 6- When a URL is broken (a site moves from another tech to Tiki), all info should be thrown to the search engine to try to find new URL for the old page
Jyhem_laptop: 6- non-ambiguous correspondance back and forth
<br> <u>ok</u>: 7- non-ambiguous correspondance back and forth
gour: <u>marclaporte</u>: under 6) you mean when 301 redirects are broken or non-existant?
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kstingel|away: <u>marclaporte</u>: heh he .... what is an "index tahank"?
Jyhem_laptop: I think if the article is "http://nextinfo.tiki.org/article192-Tiki-Passes-1-Million-Downloads" then "http://nextinfo.tiki.org/article192-blabla" should just get to the same article (meaning, the text is for search engines, the "/article192-" is enough for Tiki
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jonnyb: hi fabricius
<br> think i fixed you blog bug :)
luciash: <u>jonnyb</u>: your fix for no tabs button confirmed and regression page updated
jonnyb: just had a (possibly good) thought about sefurl - all the rewriting could be done in index.php and use the database, so everyone could customise their sefurls to suit the site
<br> thanks luciash
kstingel|away: just dropping off-topic briefly ... when multi-printing, I can add Wiki pages to result np :) - is there a way to also add Articles/Blog pages to result?
luciash: i think ideal would be if there was a feature to convert page names in URLs to lowercase ascii alpha-numerals with spaces replaced by dashes and that we need "Page Title" field badly (for Google search results/browser title) - "Description" is just a workaround
<br> for SEFURLs
jonnyb: <u>luciash</u>: agreed
<br> but it is an effective workaround :)
luciash: yes, but not ideal, because it goes to the Description meta tag too, and then the Search result is something like: My Home | My Super Site - My Home, where better would be My Home | My Super Site - All about Me, Superman
Jyhem_laptop: I don't like the idea of "convert page names in URLs to lowercase ascii alpha-numerals with spaces replaced by dashes" because this is going backwards when everybody works on ways of catering to the needs of the non-techy end users who are used to their accents.
<br> Also, on a chinese or hebrew or arabic site, *all pages* would be "_" :-)
Tiki-KGB: tikiwiki 03jonnybradley r44213 10branches/10.x/lib/wiki/editlib.php
<br> tikiwiki [FIX] wysiwyg: Only remove last empty p tag on saving. Seems to work as an extra one appears from somewhere else (thanks Geoff)
luciash: <u>Jyhem_laptop</u>: that would be optional feature of course
<br> <u>Jyhem_laptop</u>: and as I pointed out earlier - each language would need a specified "convert pattern"
<br> <u>Jyhem_laptop</u>: so it does not convert to "_" each non-ascii character
Jyhem_laptop: <u>luciash</u>: � each language would need a specified "convert pattern" � seems a lot of work for no real benefit. Search engines can handle special chars and internationalisation.
luciash: there is real benefit but i do not want to argue about it with you
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gour: anyone familiar with apache rewriting rules?
<br> i've started to play with providing set of rules for hiawatha server...starting with simple thing
<br> here is apache rule: RewriteRule ^articles$ tiki-view_articles.php [L] and online nginx converter created the following: location = /articles { rewrite ^(.*)$ /tiki-view_articles.php break; } but that didn't work in hiawatha, so i converted it into: Match ^/articles(.*)$ Rewrite /tiki-view_articles.php
<br> but maybe, according to Apache rule, just Match ^/articles$ Rewrite /tiki-view_articles.php would be more correct. what do you think?
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kstingel|away: any Ubuntu pros in here? ... need a little help with perms for dev-web-folders
<br> ^ private chat probably best
gour: kstingel|away: i'm not pro, especiall not for ubuntu, but might help
<br> kstingel|away: in short...for php, i added myself to the www-data group or the one under which your webserver is running and chown-ed /var/www or whatever is webserver's root to www-data and chmod-ed recursively to 775
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luciash: <u>gour</u>: i would not put the starting slash indicating web root maybe otherwise i think it is correct
gour: <u>luciash</u>: do you follow, tiki-devel list?
luciash: yep
gour: <u>luciash</u>: see my post ;)
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gour: <u>luciash</u>: what do you think about that proposal? is it feasible/workable...?
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Tiki|bot: New Forum Posts: Image error "File is not an image." TW9.2 - http://tiki.org/tiki-view_forum_thread.php?forumId=4&comments_parentId=45669
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luciash: <u>gour</u>: yep, i think it could work
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<br> Hi all (and polom to the others :) )
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