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WhoWhatWhen
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wikifanhttps://demo.tiki.org/17x/ is down ? getting ERR_TOO_MANY_REDIRECTS [00:45]
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https://doc.tiki.org/Documentation -> System error. The following error message was returned: Got error 28 from storage engine [03:30]
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k that's up now but the search on that page still doesn't work, just returns a blank page [05:21]
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amette_polom [09:53]
fphi, i am running a tiki 15.5 installation. the one issue i do have is that i am not happy with the search results. even if my searchstring matches around 60% of a complete tiki article this article is somewhere random in my search-results
all search results have the same relevance of 1
is that supposed to be like that?
even if i enter the complete article name to my search the article in question is not number 1 in the search result list 		[09:54]
amette_Hi fp, I assume you use MySQL full-text-search? The results of that are sadly quite arcane... they get better by using either the Lucene PHP implementation or (much better) by using an additional/external elasticsearch server. Both these things are configurable from Admin->Control Panels->Search. [09:55]
fphi amette_ . yes i am pretty sure we currently do use the mysql search
thanks for the pointers 		[09:56]
amette_np, yw [09:59]
fpmh, interesting. the paket elasticsearch is installed on that server and in 'Control Panel' -> 'Search' the unified search index is set to Elasticsearch as well
*package elasticsearch* 		[10:06]
amette_That sounds pretty good then. Time to get into tuning... ;)
Usually though the search results with elasticsearch out-of-the-box are amazingly good. 		[10:07]
fpbut i dont see a cronjob to rebuild a search index [10:08]
amette_I'm not sure, if putting 60% of the article into the search field is a good test... but usually, with two/three keywords, it gives me pretty much exactly what I want.
yes, that one would be beneficial *nod* ;) 		[10:08]
fpis there a way to check the age of a search index (elasticsearch) [10:09]
amette_And you can set additionally to update the index incrementally.ä
it should be mentioned on the Admin Search page 		[10:09]
fpmost likely in the advanced settings/view right?
Your index was last fully rebuilt on Friday, 08. July 2016 08:40:53 UTC. ;) 		[10:10]
amette_Aha! ;) [10:11]
fphow often would you recommend to optimize and/or rebuild the index? [10:13]
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amette_I usually have it to incrementally update and then do an additional rebuild it via cron nightly (when there are no/little users on the site).
If you have ginormous amounts of data, you could even do it just once per week or so. 		[10:14]
fphopefully my last question then: i do know how to rebuild it, but how to incrementally update it? [10:15]
amette_Optimization, etc. depends a lot on your data, how often it is updated, etc.
Admin -> Search: Activate "Advanced" features, then check "Incremental Index Update" 		[10:15]
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fpok. created a daily crontab to rebuild on a daily basis. icremental index update is/was already activated [10:34]
amette_Cool. Then happy searching! :) [10:35]
fpto be honest- the results dont look that much better so far ;) [10:35]
amette_lol :D
sorry, but hmmm... didn't expect that. 		[10:35]
fpmaybe i am assuming wrong that if my searchstring is part of an article it should have a higher relevancy
article-title 		[10:36]
amette_maybe you need to tweak the weights in Admin Search (never really used those myself, but they are for making these knids of adjustments) [10:37]
fplets see what i can find [10:37]
xavijoined #tikiwiki
polom 		[10:39]
amette_moloq xavi [10:39]
xavidoc.t.o yields error 500 [10:39]
amette_oops, ok, I'm on it [10:39]
xavihi amette
thks :-)
and dev.t.o shows db connection lost
:-/ 		[10:39]
amette_That was just temporary, when restarting MySQL for doc. [10:42]
xaviok, dev.t.o is up now, doc.t.o shows error 500 still [10:43]
amette_doc.t.o will take a while
can the table tiki_rss_feeds be truncated? It's over 2GB in size.
ok, no, optimize did just fine, table is now 10MB 		[10:44]
xavino idea, sorry. I reckon, if that is the source of the problem (is it really?), a better solution for all tikis out there should be found
ah, ok. I wonder how a table of 10Mb can get 2Gb in size 		[10:50]
amette_It's not the table data itself, it's the binary log (logging changes). [10:50]
xaviamette : fyi, see also this: https://irc.tiki.org/irclogger_log/tikiwiki?date=2017-10-18,Wed&sel=6#l2
amette_: ^ 		[10:50]
amette_yep, same thing, error 28 is no space left [10:51]
fpok - more questions regarding the search: Assuming title & textarea is set as heigh weight-wise for search - should an article which features my search-string several times have a higher relevancy then an article which features the text only once?
using elasticsearch which rebuilded index 		[10:52]
luciashpolom [10:54]
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fpsidenote: my 15.5 install points for more details on elasticsearch to https://doc.tiki.org/ElasticSearch - which throws a 404 [10:57]
amette_xavi, luciash, fp : doc is back [10:58]
luciashamette_: thanks! so do we need to buy more disk space? [10:59]
BsfezThanks Amette ! [10:59]
amette_What happened? tiki_rss_feeds binary logs filled up the disk, then the automatic svn up broke a PHP file, which made php throw a 500.
luciash : no 		[10:59]
xavithanks amette_
how can we make things (server-side) less fragile? 		[11:00]
luciashcan we have cron warning sent to your mail when disk space becomes critically low? [11:00]
amette_I need to change the setup of the machine. Let me explain it one last time: I had to set it up quickly, because elastichosts was down. I did the normal Debian install, which partitions the disk fully and added a swap area to the end of it. So that's why I can't just resize the disk, but will have to do a more complicated operation.
luciash : yes, there is monitoring for this. I was sleeping though. 		[11:00]
luciashah, cool
amette_: now https://security.tiki.org please 		[11:01]
fpregarding search: legacy mysql full text search must be enabled for having a search function at all right? even if elasticsearch is configured as unified search engine [11:04]
luciashamette_: error 500 [11:04]
amette_luciash : ok, hang on
luciash : back 		[11:04]
xavifp: nope, I'm afraid. Only advanced search, and choose your unified search engine. You need to disable Basic Search
at some point, this Basic Search feature should dissapear, to prevent usability issues by new users
imho
fp: see this: https://doc.tiki.org/Admin-Wizard#Set_up_Search . Basic search should be off, and Advanced Search on, which the unified search index engine of your choice. Mysql Full text Search, as unified search index, should be fine also. 		[11:13]
Bsfez+1
default was changed and a message should say it is legacy 		[11:16]
xavidoc.t.o needs updating, then, imho
I'm doing my opart with what I know from a year ago or so 		[11:21]
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polom 		[11:23]
amette_moloq chibaguy [11:26]
chibaguyhi amette_ [11:27]
fpxavi thanks for the infos. [11:36]
xavifp np.
hi chibaguy 		[11:37]
chibaguyhi xavi [11:38]
fpits getting more and more interessting. if i search via: tiki-searchresults.php the results are pretty "bad" - while searching via tiki-searchindex.php gives really good results.
we always used the search-widget - which seems to use tiki-searchresults.php
therefor the searchresults was disappointing in almost all cases 		[11:40]
amette_fp : that's what xavi meant earlier: searchresults uses the old, old mysql-search, while searchindex uses the newer "unified search index" with one of its three different backend options (Mysql, Lucene, Elasticsearch). [11:41]
fpcan i force the search widget to use the new search - aka -tiki-searchindex.php? [11:42]
amette_Just use the correct module. [11:42]
xavifp: disable the basic search, and it will use the new engine
the same module, afaik 		[11:43]
amette_ah, k, my mistake then [11:43]
xavis/afaik/afair [11:43]
amette_(thought there were two, but true, didn't see two of them the last time I configured a Tiki search) [11:43]
fpxavi: havent found that setting yet, as your linked screenshot looks totally different then my ui here ;)
still digging 		[11:43]
xavifp: use the Wizards
https://doc.tiki.org/Wizards 		[11:44]
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fpxavi: i did find and used the wizard to jump to "set up Search". i did disable 'basic search' and 'advanced search' already was enabled. I did finish that step via "Save and continue. Butthe search widget still is using tiki-searchresults.php
ignore that
reloading the wizard had basic search enabled once again. -redid my steps and it seems to work now
guys - big thanks to all of you - the search is now as i would expect a good search. this bumps my wiki 		[11:50]
amette_Cool! Glad to hear that. :) [11:56]
fpuntil now search in our tiki setup was always the ugly-child nobody was loving ;) [11:59]
amette_Yeah, I've heard that often. *g* [12:00]
fpone final sidenote regarding search: why are you splitting searchstrings on the - character? [12:00]
amette_This changes massively though once people start using the elasticsearch based one. ;)
hmm, no idea. What do you mean by splitting them? 		[12:00]
fpi do have articles for each host in our network so i.e.: vm-wsus
if i search for vm-wsus the search is highlightning VM and WSUS as individual search strings in my results
so i do enter 1 searchstring "vm-wsus" but search seems to search for "vm" "wsus"
which works still pretty good with the new search, but i was/and/am wondering why you implemented it that way 		[12:01]
amette_Aaah, good question, no idea. Maybe it's even not us doing it, but elasticsearch. Maybe there's an option for this!? [12:02]
fpas it is uncommon at least for me [12:03]
amette_if you put vm-wsus in quotes, like so "vm-wsus", when searching, does it still split it up? [12:03]
fpeven if i really quote "vm-wsus" it is used as 2 strings [12:03]
amette_hehe, k [12:03]
fpyes ...same idea ;) [12:03]
amette_:) [12:03]
xavi, luciash : I added a cron job to optimize tiki_rss_feeds table every night. It shouldn't hurt performance, but stop the disk from running full. [12:08]
xavithanks amette_
chibaguy: btw, I visited themes.t.o today (after many months of no visit ) and I see a popup in the browser saying: "A problem occurred while detecting JavaScript on this page, click ok to retry." (in both FF and Chromium
) 		[12:12]
chibaguyYes, xavi, I noticed that, too. I'll try to track it down. [12:14]
xaviok. Clikcing ok in FF did the trick after page reloadē
ah, in Chromium too.
who knows 		[12:15]
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fpbye [13:01]
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jonnybpolom [13:26]
chibaguyHi jonnyb [13:39]
jonnybhi chibaguy - bs4 branch looks good, i see you are starting to modify some tpls, woo! :) [13:40]
chibaguyThanks. Yes, a few as I come across things that are an easy fix. [13:41]
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chibaguyForms aren't looking too bad, but break pretty much when Chosen is activated. I commented out the Chosen CSS temporarily because it created many compile problems.
Same for tablesorter and I think pivottable. They can be addressed later. 		[13:45]
luciashamette_: awesome, cheers [13:54]
jonnybsounds like progress - i think it would be a good idea to keep a note (and diff's) of files you are changing outside of themes, as by the time tiki 19 comes we will get terrible conflicts otherwise i fear...
moqmoq luciash amette_ xavi and all :) 		[13:54]
luciashhello jonny
still good with the hurricane?
(except the yellow sky) 		[13:55]
chibaguyok [13:57]
jonnybwind seems to have stopped, bit gloomy and dark but not yellow today, thanks luciash :) [13:59]
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luciashjonnyb: cool, I hope ppl in the Irelands are safe as well [14:09]
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luciashjonnyb: did you have a look at the H5P in cached wiki pages issue by any chance?
https://dev.tiki.org/item6403 		[15:03]
jonnybno sorry, critical client issues only so far this week, maybe next week? [15:04]
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